Would you buy Zaire with Mooning if the price is reasonable?

[Jay T]

Hi all,

Lately, I noticed that a few local breeder selling their F1 (moba / kitumba Zaire) 4.5” – 6” for about $50 each. I think the price is very reasonable, but the sad thing is that they all have mooning. I can not accept any Zaire with mooning even if it’s dirt cheap. I don’t understand why there are so many F1 Zaire with mooning up for sale lately? What happened to a nice quality F1 with solid stripes?

[Razzo]

Originally Posted by Jay T

Hi all,

Lately, I noticed that a few local breeder selling their F1 (moba / kitumba Zaire) 4.5” – 6” for about $50 each. I think the price is very reasonable, but the sad thing is that they all have mooning. I can not accept any Zaire with mooning even if it’s dirt cheap. I don’t understand why there are so many F1 Zaire with mooning up for sale lately? What happened to a nice quality F1 with solid stripes?

If the parents are wild caught, they may be aging. Split bars and mooning seems to happen more often in a breeding group that is entering their golden years. Then there is the possibility that they really are not F1s.

Be patient and you'll find some quality fry. I'd be suprised if somebody on Cyphos couldn't hook you up with what you are looking for

[Jay T]

Thanks! The problem is that...I only want to deal with locally. I don't like the idea of shipping and buying fish without knowing what I am going to get. I don't like really surprise...

[JT]

People don't understand that the generation really doesn't have to do with quality as much as genetics does. Either way if they are small they can outgrow the mooning, but at 4-6" they won't. There are plenty of frontosa people in CA. You'll find some.

[supadave]

Originally Posted by JT

People don't understand that the generation really doesn't have to do with quality as much as genetics does. Either way if they are small they can outgrow the mooning, but at 4-6" they won't. There are plenty of frontosa people in CA. You'll find some.

+1

Someone on this forum stated that they had went to an Ad Koning lecture ...or either spoke to him personally and he stated that he saw mooning in the wild. So if you see it in the wild I would think that it's more genetic than anything else.

[Razzo]

Originally Posted by JT

People don't understand that the generation really doesn't have to do with quality as much as genetics does. Either way if they are small they can outgrow the mooning, but at 4-6" they won't. There are plenty of frontosa people in CA. You'll find some.

Of course, genetics is the issue and, as mentioned before, genetics can break down in the golden years: that is one possibility. Genetics can break down in successive generations due to inbreeding and that is why your chance is better genetically with true F1s of avoiding mooning. Chances are the owner of the wild caught parents didn't purchase wild caughts with monning. I'd be very upset if I was sent wc with mooning. So, your chances of getting fish with out mooning are greater if their parents don't have mooning. Again, that is not to say wc parents without mooning can spawn some fry with mooning.

Genetic mooning is a lack of black pigment in the black bars. Some fry with "fading" will fill in. True genetic mooning will not fill in because the black pigment is not there.

[martindale]

I p/u some 2" fry from Ron R. back in December 09' they are close to 3" now. I'll take some pics for ya tonight. I have a friend who bought 15 fry from Ron R. 3 years ago and she still has all 15. They are STUNNING! The fry I have are more purple than blue. I would STRONGLY recommend sending Ron a pm and asking if he is equiped to ship. The last time I spoke to him he said he was going to get verified with SWA. Good luck. Shout out Ron! Hey Ron if your out there wathcha think about your little ones?

It depends on what you intend on doing with your Zaire's. If I wanted them for trophy fish only and received some fish with mooning I would have to make a judgement call at that point. I always acquire fish with breeding as a long term goal though and under these circumstances I would NEVER start out with fish that have mooning. There seems to be a lot of different opinions on this subject. IMO mooning occurs in the wild as well as in tank raised fish. Im sure we have a member who has ordered w/c Zaire and now owns fish that have mooning. I just wouldnt want to own one. Saying a fish has perfect bloodline is a relative statement or most commonly stated beauty is in the eyes of the beholder. All things considered I choose to own, under any circumstances, a Zaire exactly like the fish I purchased from Ron in the pics below. To answer your question, NO I would NOT purchase a Zaire for any price that has mooning.

[Razzo]

BTW: I forgot to answer the question: no, I would not buy any fry with "genetic mooning" at any price. It is my preference to not have mooning.

I would buy Ron's fry in a heart beat (good color, nice bars straight bars, dark bars). That is what I would look for personally.

[neutrinoman]

Ok, so if I follow your posts here, you're not asking for advice, you're asking how other people feel about it?

Personally, there'd be no reason for me to settle for cheap Zaires if they're not good quality. As far as plenty of sources of Zaires, not at all true in my area. I'd have to either get them shipped or drive somewhere to get them, anyway. All the more reason not to settle for cheap chips Zaire fronts.

[melcp]

no i wouldnt buy zaires with split bars regardless of how cheap they are.
heck, i probably wouldnt even take them if they were free.
you may save some money now, and you can say you have zaires but
it would probably bother you and you probably wont be happy
with them in the long run. then you'll end up with zaires most
true hobbyist wouldnt want to buy anyways.
so i say pass it up.

btw, Ron probably has some of the best frys ive seen.